Presentation by Dr. Tom Davis – 355

Today's show presents Dr. Tom Davis' lecture on becoming a consultant to venture capital firms from the 2023 Nonclinical Career Summit.

This serves as a motivational guide for those looking to navigate the consulting landscape successfully. Tom also shares his advice on using the consulting relationship to become a shareholder in selected start-ups.

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We're proud to have the University of Tennessee Physician Executive MBA Program, offered by the Haslam College of Business, as the sponsor of this podcast. The UT PEMBA is the longest-running, and most highly respected physician-only MBA in the country. It has over 700 graduates. And, the program only takes one year to complete. By joining the UT Physician Executive MBA, you will develop the business and management skills you need to find a career that you love. To find out more, contact Dr. Kate Atchley’s office at (865) 974-6526 or go to nonclinicalphysicians.com/physicianmba.

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Overcoming “The Dip”

Dr. Tom Davis, a board-certified family physician, shares his journey into healthcare consulting. Despite initial struggles and feeling stuck in what Seth Godin calls “The Dip,” Tom persevered. His breakthrough came unexpectedly with a lucrative offer from a venture capital firm, which marked his transformation into a successful professional consultant.

Types of Consulting

Dr. Davis outlines the three primary types of consulting:

1.  Skills-Based Consulting: Utilizing specific skills clients lack, like creating a motivational video.
2.  Credibility Consulting: Lending credibility to client decisions, often based on reputation and Google rankings.
3.  Advisory Services: Providing strategic advice, often under retainer agreements, to venture capitalist firms and other entities.

Building Trust and Value

Dr. Davis emphasizes the importance of consistency and value in establishing trust with clients. Drawing from Seth Godin’s analogy, he highlights the need to offer valuable insights consistently, akin to placing a crisp $10 bill in a neighbor's mailbox daily, to build credibility and eventually secure larger client commitments.

Summary

For more information or to connect with Dr. Tom Davis, visit his website at tomdavisconsulting.com. He also shares valuable insights on LinkedIn, where you can follow his professional updates and articles. Tom is also a professional speaker and podcast guest, sharing his expertise in value-based care and telemedicine.

NOTE: Look below for a transcript of today's episode. 

EXCLUSIVE: Get a daily dose of inspiration, information, news, training opportunities, and amusing stories by CLICKING HERE.

Links for Today's Episode:

• Dr. Tom Davis Website
• How to Become an Author, Consultant and Online Authority with Dr. Tom Davis – 047
• Purchase the Complete 12-Lecture Package from the 2023 Nonclinical Career Summit
• Purchase Your All Action Pass Videos and Bonuses from the 2024 Summit
• Dr. Debra Blaine's Coaching Services

Download This Episode:

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Podcast Editing & Production Services are provided by Oscar Hamilton

Today's PNC Podcast Transcript

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Transcription PNC Podcast Episode 355

How to Become a Consultant to Venture Capital Firms

- Presentation by Dr. Tom Davis

Dr. Tom Davis: My first love was really consulting and value-based care. That was my goal as I started to pivot, but I was very discouraged at that time because I really wasn't getting the traction I wanted. I was getting clients, but I wasn't succeeding as well as I had thought.

I was in a period that the marketer named Seth Godin called "The Dip." After you've gotten started and you're very excited, then suddenly things just don't move as fast as you want, and you're kind of in the doldrums, and it's important to work through it.

Well, I remember this day. I was just laying on a couch, and it was my day off from my employee position as an FP, and the phone rang. Normally, the phone rings. It's probably another kind of basic engagement, or it's a telemedicine clinician looking for some help. I had been working very hard and diligently trying to engage potential clients in my practice. I had a website up that I blogged on a regular basis. I had a couple books out.

I did some professional speaking. I really was doing everything that I should, but your clients really don't care about that. They only care if you can solve their problems, so when the phone rang, I answered it without a lot of anticipation, and it was this gentleman from a venture capital firm looking for my assistance in helping them place evaluation on an acquisition that they were looking for, and we talked.

He's a very engaging guy, and eventually, he got the fees. He asked me what I would charge for advising them for a period of three months, and I told him I had to find out exactly how much value I could generate, and I didn't like hourly wages. I really liked retainer arrangements, and he responded, "Well, we can't pay you more than $50,000."

Well, I give myself great credit that I didn't choke or sputter because that was 10 times what I had earned in any other previous engagement, and normally you would take that as a starting point and begin to negotiate, but I took that money and ran because it was the very first time I really felt like a professional consultant.

Now, as John said, my name is Tom Davis. I'm a board-certified family physician. I came out of residency, and with my new partners in rural Missouri, we founded Patients First Healthcare, which was the first value-based care health system in the country. Lots of firsts there that I'll spare you from, but in 2012, we were acquired for more money than anybody should ever be paid, and with that acquisition, I decided that I needed to spread the love because practicing as a value-based care physician was just like walking on air. It was wonderful, so I still had three years on a personal service agreement with the folks who acquired us, so I started opening up my consultancy.

I stumbled into telemedicine. I did that on the side just for my own edification and as a service to my fellow clinicians, but that was the course that led me to that afternoon in 2015 when I became a real consultant, and after all, all consulting is, is helping someone, just helping someone fill a need, whatever that particular need is, and there's three basic types of consulting.

There's skilled-based consulting. When you have a skill, you're a web developer or a marketer that the potential client doesn't have, and they need to hire someone outside. For example, last year, I got an engagement to create a three-minute video to kind of rally the troops in this given organization to help them with their value-based care initiative. They paid me $3,000. Actually, they paid me $5,000. I spent three hours going on and creating the video for them, and that was it. So that was a skill I offered. They didn't have it internally.

Boom, it was done. I'm creating my own web, a new web presence for my consulting firm right now. I don't have the expertise in WordPress. I'm hiring somebody to create it. That's skills-based consulting, and that is certainly something that clinicians can do.

The second type of consulting is credibility consulting, and your goal there is really to your client's ass because they have either made a decision or they're about to make a decision, and they need somebody with some credibility that can help justify their decision, and this is something that I have some experience with.

Charissa told the story that back in 2020, when the whole health system went online, she was suddenly very busy with her telemedicine practice. Well, I was in the same place. That first weekend, I took 250 calls in my practice. It was quite hectic, but at the same time, if you Googled telemedicine, telemedicinemastery.com with my name right behind it and the MD there was the fifth non-boosted result that you would get.

Suddenly my phone was ringing off the hook as a telemedicine consultant, and because I was organically that high in Google's rankings, I had credibility, and what I discovered being a credibility consultant is they're really not interested in your expertise. What they're interested in is getting your credibility so that they can justify the decisions that have already been made.

I had engagements with several dozen folks over the first six weeks. Some of them were paid. Many of them were not once I figured out what was going on, but in almost every case, not every case, but almost every case, the client had been given a load of money, and they had already decided how to apportion it, and they simply needed somebody with credibility in order to rubber stamp that decision.

Now, these clients have bosses. Everybody has a boss. Sometimes it was the CEO of an organization had to answer to his board. Sometimes it was someone a little lower on the food chain that had to answer to their boss. Once you get that high up in the corporate structure, it's much less hierarchical than you think. It's very much a group, a collaborative practice where everybody's covering for everybody else. But as a credibility consultant, they wanted somebody that they could say, hey, this guy was high on Google. When we searched, nobody else knows anything about this. This guy is going to support what we want to do.

Now, occasionally, when you're a credibility consultant, there are folks who actually have plans for their money or for their processes, but they still bring you in to rubber stamp them. Then when you try to share your expertise with them, they get angry. That was a lesson I learned too back in 2020, having never been a credibility consultant before and not understanding what these folks want to buy. They simply wanted to buy your credibility. After about six months, my Google searches got suppressed because other folks were boosting theirs, as you can with SEO. My days as a credibility consultant were blessedly limited.

During that time, it was extremely instructive. One of the things I learned was that I didn't want to be a credibility consultant. That doesn't mean that it's not a reasonable path for a clinician, especially when coming out of school and not wanting or able to go into residency. You have to remember, these folks are selling credibility. The folks that they put out in the field are generally young. They're selling things that give them credibility, but they're not selling their expertise.

You don't have to be an expert to be a credibility consultant. You just have to be willing to put in the hours and be good at getting new business. That's the coin of the realm with these credibility consultants. They want you to generate billable hours and they want you to generate new business. It really is the Thunderdome to determine who's going to move up the ranks and be offered a partnership. If that's you, having an MDDO is the equivalent of having a business degree from a branded business school.

A final word on credibility consultants is that I have worked with a significant number of female folks in that industry. They are universal about the amount of misogyny and sexual harassment that goes on from their point of view. Never had a man tell me about that, but had virtually every woman tell me about some pretty significant exploitation.

If you're female and you're thinking about doing that, I felt a word to the wise was indicated. Surprisingly, credibility consulting is not what we're talking about today. It's not venture capital consulting.

Consulting with venture capital folks falls under the third type of consulting and that is advisory services. But advisory services is exactly what it sounds like. People pay you to give them advice. They might take it, they might not, but that's what they're paying you for. Typically, an advisory consultant works under a retainer arrangement, meaning that you get paid a certain amount of money to provide advisory services for a certain period of time. I have an advisory arrangement with a venture capital firm right now.

They paid me back in July for one year. We worked together for about 20 hours and then I haven't heard from them again until this very morning where they wanted to talk to me again. That's fine. We had an arrangement for an entire year. That is usually how they're structured. You can charge for that based on the value that you think that you are providing them because what they want is your expertise.

Now, I didn't start out providing advisory services of venture capital folks. I started to do it to payers, to health systems, to individual clinicians and then I started attracting some vendors, people who are selling technologies to support value-based care billing systems. All this time, I was learning the craft until that fateful day in 2015 that I told you about.

When you're a consultant, any of these three types of consultants, but especially advisory consultants, you are telling your client a story. That's what you want them to buy. You want them to buy the story that you can fill their needs.

For a skills-based consultant, you have the skills and you're going to complete things on time. That's the story that you're selling to them. If they hire you, they bought it.

For credibility consultants, it's, "You know what? We'll keep you safe. We're the safe choice. We'll cover you. We'll endorse whatever you want." That's the credibility consultant. For the advisory consultant, it's "I have expertise. I have something that I have knowledge that you need that can get you to a better place."

Now, when we talk about folks in the VC world, I like to ask audiences what they think that the VC, the people that work in these venture capital and other investing groups want to achieve from their business plan. What is their goal as doing what they're doing? And most folks will say, well, they want to make money. And that's only partially correct. These folks want to make more money than other people. So they're intensely competitive, just as competitive as anybody that we knew in medical school. They don't just don't want to make money. The absolute amount of money is nice, but it matters more that they beat their compatriots. They want an edge. They want to know something that somebody else doesn't know.

Because in the investing world, asymmetrical information is how you make your game. So the story that you're selling them is that you are the diamond in the rough. You're the one that everybody else has missed that has what they need to give you that edge. That's the story that you're selling these folks. And if you sell them that story, if you put that out there, it's just like a lure. Eventually, somebody will bite.

Now, how do you put out that story? Well, it's pretty straightforward. Again, Seth Godin is one of the folks that I read heavily as I was learning how to do this. He gave a great allegory about a next door neighbor that just moved in. And he doesn't know you from Adam. And if you were to go over there the first day that he moved in and ask him to cash a $500 check for you, he would think you are nuts.

He certainly wouldn't take a check from you. But if for 90 days, every morning at 8am as he's pulling out for work, he sees you walk over and put a crisp $10 bill in his mailbox. Then on the 91st day, he will cash that check.

So what you're doing is giving him a small amount of value on a consistent basis in a way that he recognizes in a way that he is easily absorbable. So that when you do make the ask, that he's much more likely to take you up on it. Imagine if instead of a $500 check on that 90th day, 91st day, you just did $100 check. Well, he's much more likely to do that. Then you keep on giving him the 10 bucks. A couple months later, you ask for a $500 check. He'll do that. Then you do for a couple months, you ask for a $750 check. So he's learned to trust you.

He's learned to understand that you are providing value. So he's willing to give you something that he values in return. And that is how you reach out to folks to tell them your story, to get them to give you something that they value, which is their time, their money, the engagement. And how you do that depends on who your customer is.

Now for venture capital, the platform of choice is LinkedIn. LinkedIn is a B2B or a business-to-business platform. And although I'm in the middle of renovating my LinkedIn platform as part of my new updated internet presence, you can still see that I regularly release information on a regular basis that's free. It's high value. And it encourages folks to tell themselves a story that I'm their edge. I'm their angle. And I blogged almost every day for five years. You can still see a portion of that blog on tomdavisconsulting.com. And it's no great shakes. It didn't get millions of hits. In fact, some days it only got one or two.

But the people that saw that are the people who I wanted to tell themselves a story. It's all about releasing information freely on a regular basis, day in and day out. I did professional speaking. I wrote books. I did podcast after podcast after podcast. And just by throwing that hook out every day in the still waters, regardless of what the weather was like, eventually somebody bit. And since that time, the venture capital folks have been my most enjoyable and fulfilling clients. And it's not because they do what I suggest. I usually don't have any idea what they decide based on the information that I ask. But they reach out to me for specific needs. I answer their questions, do the analyses that they ask for. And in return, they're very grateful.

Now, you have to compare and contrast this to doing the same thing with other potential clients like payers or health systems. Those folks, their check's clear. There's no question about that.

But there is a lot more institutional inertia about the types of advice that they'll accept. And sat around the table more than once to get verbally abused by folks that didn't like what I had to say. And again, that's OK. There's no more engaging those folks. And again, their check is cleared. But you did their best for them. That never happens with venture capital. I'm always treated with respect and always treated with professional courtesy. And that is not something that I can say dealing with my fellow clinicians, not by a long shot.

Now, one of the benefits that everybody thinks comes with consulting in venture capital is that you get in on the ground floor. Sometimes you can get a piece of the company early on in exchange for giving advice and instead of getting a fee. And you don't know you'll get a piece of the next eBay or Amazon or something like that.

And there's actually some truth to that, but only if you approach the situation in the right way. So there are companies, usually tech firms, that offer supportive technologies for folks in value-based care. And oftentimes, after an initial engagement of consulting with them, we'll talk about further engagements.

And I'll offer to do that in exchange for a piece of the action. And here's a first technical tip if you ever do get in this position is only ask for a teeny tiny little small slice. And the reason for that is twofold.

One is that the more that you ask, the more they can demand of you. So that puts you in a situation of being a stock picker, of trying to pick and choose the winners in an environment where very, very, very, very few organizations actually reach the finish line and either get acquired or go public. Your best bet, your best strategy, is to take a little, when the opportunity comes, is take a little bit of a whole lot of companies.

And when one converts, then you call that a win. None of those things are going to put you in the cent-a-millionaire club, but when they do convert, it's very, very nice. So there are opportunities to do that, but the wise way to approach that is to simply take small pieces of a number of different companies.

And usually, those opportunities don't present themselves until you've had a successful collaboration with them first. And I've had collaborations with companies that either I didn't do a good job on or they didn't like what I had to say, and so no further offers were forthcoming. And that's okay.

That's just part of life. But when you do get those opportunities, use the technique that I discussed and you will be in a much better position. Now, to reach out to these firms, some of these social media platforms offer opportunities to boost or to do direct mailings.

I don't do any of that stuff. I don't want to annoy or bother any potential clients, just like you don't move the hook around when you're trying to fish. You just offer them something of value. If they want it, they want it. If they don't, they don't. The key is consistency and high value and doing it every day. And you realize over time that what you're doing as a consultant is basically what you're doing as a doctor.

What are we but advisory consultants? We have expertise. The patients come in. We advise them. A lot of times they don't do what we say. Sometimes they do. If we're specialists, we have primary care doctors that send their patients to us for a consultation. In the old days, that's exactly what it was. You send them to another doctor for their opinion. The doctor sent them back to you with recommendations on how to treat them. That's exactly what we do now.

And so when you enter consulting with that mindset, it actually makes things a lot more comfortable. And then as you are more successful consulting in the venture capital space, you will start to realize that it is different than being successful in another space. So when I help a clinician generally, he will refer me to his friends.

When I help a health system, generally, I get referrals for their colleagues who work in other health systems, not ones that are directly competing from them, but other health systems. When I work for vendors, these folks, these technology firms, they collapse all the time and talent gets redistributed. And then I get word of mouth referrals in that fashion.

That's very common. But you have to understand that the story that you're selling in venture capital is that you are the edge that they need. And so they're not going to tell other folks that they're competing with that they need to talk to you. So you're not going to get any word of mouth. And it took me a little while to understand that. Really, you have to rely on them passively coming to you after you have set the hook.

Now, again, this is we've talked again about nine years before you're successful overnight. Being a consultant is very much that path. It was years of blog posting and learning how to be a professional speaker and working on all of my skills before I got that big bite.

I also had a number of consulting engagements where I didn't know what I was doing. And some of those did a bad job. And you just have to learn from your mistakes and move on. The nice part about it in consulting, nobody dies when you make a mistake. I've been fortunate not to have that. But you have to understand it's a learning process.

It is a journey. But if you stick with it, then good things can happen. So it's not something that you want to do right off the gate and say, I'm going to quit my job. And tomorrow, I'm going to earn the same amount of money being consulted. It doesn't work that way. Fortunately, it is a job that you can usually do on the side outside of your non-compete.

You got to always have your lawyer check on that. But non-competes are usually pretty restrictive. And for them to cover something non-clinical like consulting, that's a pretty restrictive non-compete and may be hard to enforce.

It is something that you can start doing right now just by putting yourself out there. Every one of us that are looking at this has expertise that venture capital firms are looking for, because they're always looking to invest in something new, something novel, something that nobody else is investing in.

Now, everything has a fashion. When there's one superhero movie, everybody makes superhero movies. When there's one successful type of tech firm, everybody tries to invest in those tech firms, those similar tech firms. And there's some truth to that. But that's only part of what goes on in the angel investor venture capital world. There are always folks looking for the next thing. There's always folks who have budgeted a certain amount of money to invest in speculative endeavors.

EBay is a great example of something that was totally speculative when it came down. Bidding on the internet, who the heck knows? Nobody knows that. And it subsequently sold for several billion dollars. So there are always people that set aside a little bit of their pile of money to invest in speculative investments. And these are things that you have expertise in.

For me, it's value-based care. For Narissa, it could be working with a person that has developed a new medication or new drug that she has special knowledge about. For sports medicine folks, it could be somebody that's looking at investing a new business-to-consumer rehab platform. You just never know until you put it out there. Because these people are either running their own money or they're running somebody else's money who has aligned incentives with them. And they are looking, looking, looking, looking for that edge that will help them to succeed.

And the internet has lowered the barriers of connectivity to essentially zero. There's really no expense other than your time to put into it. And that's one of the reasons why I really like consulting, because after paying hundreds of thousands of dollars for my medical education, I wasn't ready to lay out any more money, any more capital to invest in a new career.

Consulting is completely unlicensed. It's unregulated, and it's not going to be regulated. Anybody can hang up the shingles and call themselves a consultant. You don't need any credentials. You don't need anything but a story, a story that someone else will accept that you will get them to a better place.

And for my money, the apex is working with these folks who run money. They are very serious. They're very talented. It's very intellectually stimulating and challenging, and you can really make a difference. Also, there's just a teeny, teeny, teeny, tiny little chance that you could, while you're helping other people, while you're still scratching that itch, you could hit it big. And when you do, when that happens, it feels all those failures fall away, and you feel wonderful.

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The opinions expressed here are mine and my guest’s. While the information provided on the podcast is true and accurate to the best of my knowledge, there is no express or implied guarantee that using the methods discussed here will lead to success in your career, life, or business.

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The post How to Become a Consultant to Venture Capital Firms appeared first on NonClinical Physicians.

Presentation by Dr. Maria Abunto – 352

Today's episode presents an excerpt from Dr. Maria Abunto's masterclass on securing your first nonclinical MSL job from the 2023 Nonclinical Career Summit.

Dr. Maria Abunto, a senior manager of medical science liaisons (MSLs) at Exact Sciences, shares her journey and insights into the MSL role. Dr. Abunto's insights focus on relationship-building, continuous learning, and strategic networking. Whether you are considering a career change or seeking to understand the MSL role better, this post offers valuable guidance and inspiration.

Our Show Sponsor

We're proud to have the University of Tennessee Physician Executive MBA Program, offered by the Haslam College of Business, as the sponsor of this podcast. The UT PEMBA is the longest-running, and most highly respected physician-only MBA in the country. It has over 700 graduates. And, the program only takes one year to complete. By joining the UT Physician Executive MBA, you will develop the business and management skills you need to find a career that you love. To find out more, contact Dr. Kate Atchley’s office at (865) 974-6526 or go to nonclinicalphysicians.com/physicianmba.

Our Episode Sponsor

Dr. Debra Blaine is a physician like many of you, and her greatest challenge was fear. The whole concept of leaving clinical medicine was terrifying. But she is so much happier now as a professional writer and a coach. According to Debra, “It’s like someone turned the oxygen back on.” If fear is part of your struggle, too, she would like to help you push through those emotional barriers to go after the life you really want. Click this link to schedule a free chat. Or check out her website at allthingswriting.com/resilience-coaching.

From Academia to Industry: Dr. Maria Abunto's Journey

Dr. Maria Abunto transitioned from academia to industry, bringing experience from the NIH, Stryker, and now Exact Sciences. Her journey began with a master's degree in public health, where she developed a passion for public service. Driven to make a broader impact, she ventured into the world of medical science liaisons (MSLs).

Dr. Abunto shares her personal story, highlighting the importance of investing in oneself and continuously seeking opportunities to learn and grow. Her transition underscores the value of networking and finding mentors who can guide and support one's career path.

The MSL Role: Responsibilities and Rewards

The MSL role established over 50 years ago is vital in the biopharma industry. MSLs are responsible for building relationships with key opinion leaders (KOLs) and educating them on the science and advancements in treatment related to a company's product. This communication-focused role requires a strong scientific background, typically a doctorate, and excellent interpersonal skills.

Dr. Abunto explains that MSLs work remotely, managing their schedules and traveling to meet with KOLs. The role offers significant rewards, including high compensation, flexible work arrangements, and the opportunity to make a meaningful impact in healthcare.

Finding Your First Nonclinical MSL Job: Tips and Strategies

Breaking into the MSL role can be challenging but achievable with the right preparation and strategy. Dr. Abunto advises aspiring MSLs to focus on matching their skills and experiences with specific therapeutic areas and companies.

Networking is crucial. Attending industry conferences, joining professional organizations like the MSL Society, and connecting with key MSL leaders can open doors to opportunities. Additionally, enrolling in relevant training programs can enhance one's qualifications. Dr. Abunto also emphasizes the importance of building quality professional contacts and researching target companies to stand out in the competitive MSL job market.

Summary

To learn more you should explore the MSL Society website, which offers information and training opportunities for aspiring Medical Science Liaisons. To connect with Maria check out her profile on LinkedIn, where she is likely active and engaging with the medical and scientific community. For detailed presentations and insights from the 2023 Nonclinical Careers Summit, including Dr. Abunto's complete talk, visit the 2023 Summit’s Official Page.

NOTE: Look below for a transcript of today's episode. 

EXCLUSIVE: Get a daily dose of inspiration, information, news, training opportunities, and amusing stories by CLICKING HERE.

Links for Today's Episode:

• Dr. Maria Abunto's LinkedIn Page
• Why You Should Celebrate International MSL Day -135
• Medical Science Liaison Is Still a Fantastic Pharma Job – 261
• Complete the Journey to Your First Fabulous MSL Job – 277
• MSL Society Website
• Purchase the Complete 12-Lecture Package from the 2023 Nonclinical Career Summit
• Purchase Your All Action Pass Videos and Bonuses from the 2024 Summit
• Dr. Debra Blaine's Coaching Services

Download This Episode:

Right Click Here and “Save As” to download this podcast episode to your computer.

Podcast Editing & Production Services are provided by Oscar Hamilton

Today's PNC Podcast Transcript

Email Download New Tab

Transcription PNC Podcast Episode 352

Find Your Great First Nonclinical MSL Job

- Interview with Dr. Maria Abunto

John: Dr. Maria Abunto is the senior manager of medical science liaisons at ExactSciences, a molecular diagnostics company specializing in the detection of early-stage cancers. Before she worked there, she was global medical science liaison for Stryker. And she previously worked as an epidemiologist and investigator for the NIH and as a medical scientific expert on the IRB at a large children's hospital. She holds a master's degree in public health from the University of Pittsburgh and she completed a medical degree at the University of the East in Manila, Philippines. All right.

Today's podcast episode is the first half of her presentation from the 2023 Non-Clinical Career Summit in which she describes the MSL biopharma role, why it is a popular non-clinical career, and how to land your first MSL job. So let's jump in as she describes how she landed her first role as an MSL.

Dr. Maria Bunto: I'm Maria Bunto and I'll give a talk about coming from academia to industry or going from the ivory tower to the dark side. So the purpose of my presentation is to educate you on what is a medical science liaison or MSL. And if there's one thing I'd like for you to remember about being an MSL, it's not really bad at all. In fact, it's quite the opposite. It's one of the best jobs in the world and I'm fortunate to have transitioned to a non-clinical career that I love. And hopefully my talk will resonate with some of you.

So this is my disclaimer and the views and opinions are my own and do not reflect that of exact sciences, my employer, and I have no financial relationships to disclose.

So here's an outline of what I'll be talking about today. I'll start with a background about myself and my journey of how I transitioned. Then I'll talk about the MSL role, who MSLs are, and what compensation looks like, and then highlight the pros and cons of being an MSL. Then I'll take a deeper dive into how to become an MSL and briefly talk about the different career paths. I'll provide some information about the MSL society, their training and other resources.

So I'm just gonna go ahead and go into my why. This is my story and I'd like to spend just a few minutes and take you through my journey. Everyone has their unique experiences. So I think it's really important to connect with all of you, the audience out there who's interested and just figuring out what your why is. and why you want to transition. So as a physician, I have had previous experiences as a medical director, supervising operations for a busy family medicine practice. And during that time, I saw countless health disparities and underserved populations without any support or insurance. And so chronic disease is being passed down from generation to generation. And it's just one day that I just had an epiphany at a health fair and we were conducting where I realized I didn't wanna do this anymore, but rather just really focusing on understanding really what's going on here and what's happening upstream in a lot of these marginalized populations and how can we prevent that domino effect downstream?

So I always knew that I wanted to be more than just a medical director. I really wanted to affect populations on a greater level and really make that difference on even a more broader impact. while continuing to develop myself professionally. So identified public health problems, but I also realized the solution really starts with me. So the decision, this became my why. But how I was going to do this was the big question is how was I going to reinvent myself? So I knew my strengths were in public service and building connections and relationships. But I also realized during the soul searching that in order to do this, I needed to up my game and invest in myself. So my journey really begins in 2016 when I went back to graduate school and obtained my master in public health at the University of Pittsburgh. So this was a really great decision and wise investment because I needed to focus and reinvent myself. So I really worked hard to increase my knowledge and skillset, and I discovered that I absolutely loved learning as an adult student, but I didn't know what I would be doing after graduation, but I kept going and I didn't stop and I kept looking for opportunities.

It's in academia where I found an opportunity to expand my network. build my meaningful connections and relationships. So at the bottom right of the corner of the screen here, I'm pictured at graduation with my program director and long time mentor, Dr. David Feingold and the former Dean of Public Health, Dr. Donald Burke. And like I mentioned, I knew my strengths were not only in relationship building, but in public service. So at the top right is where I immersed myself in the Center for Health Equity Initiatives, such as Take the Health Professional to the People Day. So that's where I would conduct blood pressure screenings at barbershops and salons and inner cities around Pittsburgh. And you see, after all these years, I'm still volunteering in a community and giving back. It's been about a decade now. And these are opportunities like creating these long-term relationships with mentors. I also had an awesome mentor during grad school, who after graduation, I joined him at his lab at the National Institutes of Health and Population Sciences is at the NIH. And that's me pictured there on the left-hand corner. at the NIH Clinical Center in Bethesda, Maryland. That's really how I got into research because not only my connections, but my public health experience.

So it was at the NIH where I said, I mentioned that I conducted colorectal cancer research and that I became an epidemiologist there, attended all conferences and network like crazy. And I think that's where in 2017, I joined the MSL Society and became really active. And I attended the three-day live MSL communication and presentation skills training. There I learned as much as I could about being an MSL because I didn't really know I've heard about it, but it was really when I learned more about it that it appealed to me. And it was at the MSL Society Women's Conference in 2018 where I met a physician MSL. She introduced me to her career coach. And I immediately consulted that coach. So I wanted to realize that coach was also a physician. I wanted to really understand, is this a good fit for me? How hard is it to break into the role? She really helped me after 10 months. I landed my first job in industry. It was because of a connection she had, another physician who was hiring at a medical device company. And I know that after working there my first week, I just knew that I loved it and it was such a good fit. So in a nutshell, That was my career path and I'd have to say, I continue to solidify these relationships in the roles with MSLs and MSL leaders who continuously inspire me.

So now let's talk about the MSL role. The MSL was first established in 1967 by the Upjohn company and has existed for more than 50 years. And it continues to evolve in line with the changing diseases, treatment landscapes and healthcare trends. So MSLs were created in response to the need for a professionally trained staff to build rapport with influential physicians known in the pharma industry as key opinion leaders or KOLs and then thought leaders in various therapeutic areas of research. So MSLs became a part of medical affairs department where their activities revolve around building relationships with KOLs, but it's important to note that in the US the MSL is not a commercial role. or a promotional one. It's also not a science role, but rather a communication role through science, where discussions revolve around the research and the data behind the drug or product. So in the past, an advanced clinical degree was not required. However, in the late 1980s and 90s, a number of companies began to require MSLs to hold a doctorate degree, such as an MD, PharmD, or PhD, and now even Doctorate of Nursing, or DNP. As the MSL role grew over the years, the doctorate degrees became the new standard. Many companies require these credentials because MSLs are often viewed as more credible and it helps really establish those peer-to-peer relationships with doctors who you will be working with. And it's a growing field, which is a good sign. It's growing at a rate of about 10% a year with at least one out of four MSLs being hired without previous MSL experience. So over the years, companies have used various titles for the role and Medical Science Liaison or MSL is not the only name, it is called, for example, Pfizer calls MSL's field medical directors or FMDs and Amgen refers to them as regional leaders. So I'd also like to point out that obtaining a master degree may not likely make you a better applicant unless that degree really strengthens your match to the specific MSL role. But we have seen, and also on our team, we've had people that had master degrees and go on to also get a PhD while they're working for an industry company. So what is the purpose of the MSO role? The primary purpose is to be a scientific or disease state expert in the therapeutic area of the company product or pipeline.

So what is an MSL? Well, an MSL is one who holds a clinical degree in the life sciences with extensive experience in clinical medicine and or research. A doctor degree is preferred, but I've seen, as I mentioned, MSLs with master degree break into the role. There are more PhDs and PharmDs or MDs. And lately we've seen a lot of DERS practitioners and also physician assistants transitioning to become MSLs. So an MSL is employed by a pharma, biotech or medical device company. And He or she is a subject matter expert in a particular therapeutic area, such as oncology, hematology, and immunology. Now oncology and immunology, they lead the way with growth rates of about 31% and 28% respectively. And MSL's primary function is to educate on the science and advances in the treatment of the drug or product in a fair and balanced manner.

So it's a remote job where one works from home, one has a home office, and arranges meetings with KOLs or healthcare providers, either in person or virtually. So this diagram is event diagram and really illustrates what the role of the MSL encompasses. So the circle on the left contains all of the people with the science degrees, which is the PharmD, MD, PhDs. And these are people like yourself who have the proven science skills and have spent hours and hours conducting research or practicing science. Now the circle on the right This contains the people with communication relationship driven skills. So these are the soft skills. And that includes emotional intelligence and self-awareness. The circle on the left is necessary but not sufficient to land an MSL role. However, the circle on the right is full of people you want to be with, but is no good without the technical science skills found on the left. The silver middle, the sliver in the middle is where the two circles intersect and that's why the MSL talent is so hard to come by. However, as mastering the science and having degree is found in every candidate, what's often overlooked are the soft skills and the communication skills, as I mentioned, which actually may even be more important here. So MSLs are excellent communicators and this quality is really what is what makes one stand out. It's one thing to know the science and it's quite another to communicate the science. And if you think of the communication rolled through science, that's what makes an awesome MSL.

What are some of the responsibilities of an MSL? The primary responsibility is to establish and maintain relationships with KOLs who are influential doctors or healthcare providers. So since MSLs are subject matter experts of the science behind the products, engagements with KOLs involve discussions about the disease state and can involve education through presentations. An MSL first starts by KOL mapping in their territory and identifying who the key influencers are. and who are important players to get in front of as they begin strategizing and building relationships. A typical day involves proactively reaching out to a list of KOLs, and the MSL will introduce himself or herself through an email or a phone call. And then introductions can also happen at conferences or through your commercial sales force. The goal is to be able to schedule a one-on-one meeting, engage in conversation, and begin to build those relationships. And then from these conversations, may find that the KOL is interested in conducting a clinical trial that aligns with the pharma company or the KOL may request more education on the pivotal study about a company product recently launched. And whatever the outcome, collecting insights are important information to bring back to the company because insights are considered currency to the overall business, especially competitive intelligence insights. And sometimes these meetings are in-person and require travel. And so travel days are an average about two to three days per week. and are structured around the KOL schedule. But you can also modify your schedule, really makes sense to you. If you think according to the metrics of the company or of your team, if you can actually meet those metrics in two to three meetings, half virtual, half in person, minimal travel, that can be accomplished too. So it's really about you being the CEO or you managing and being the manager of your territory.

So here's a survey that was conducted by the MSL Society in 2020 and showing the many different activities that MSLs participate in and can be found on the website, which is free for all members. And also, I think there's also free resources for non-members. And as you can see, majority of the MSLs, over 98%, they manage KOL relationships. And approximately 90% of MSL surveyed said that they attend medical conferences and also provide education through scientific presentations. MSLs focus on meetings with those who are experts and thought leaders because they are influencing how others practice or conduct research using the product or the drug treatment. And an MSL would do that through a peer-to-peer scientific exchange. And the scientific exchange has two aspects to it. The first aspect of the role is a therapeutic area subject matter expert. So disease state awareness and the knowledge of the competitive landscape and the company specific products and pipeline. The second aspect is bringing value that the KOL wants. And sometimes they don't need the MSL scientific acumen. So sometimes what they want are opportunities. For instance, opportunities like a grant for an investigator led study or clinical trial. And sometimes KOLs are not looking for that scientific information, but looking to the MSL to be that conduit to the company's resources to help their career or institutions like being on an advisory board or speaker on podium or an author of a publication. So as an MSL, you will have to know the KOL very well to find out what it is that you can bring value to them. Is it the scientific presentations or is it the career opportunities? And the key is to meet the KOLs where they're at. So now let's shift a little bit and talk about who MSLs are and what compensation looks like. I think this is a really nice set of slides from the MSL Society data that shows an infograph of the makeup of the MSL surveyed by the MSL Society in 2020. 2023 results are very similar. So they surveyed over 2000 MSL professionals and the results in the US showed there was an overwhelming number of women MSLs compared to men, more than half were women and about 41% were men. 31% of MSLs work in the oncology space while 15% of MSLs work in Majority of MSL surveyed were white who had a PhD degree at 39%, followed by 27% for PharmDs. So only 8% of MSLs had a medical degree. The top three places where MSLs work are in large, medium, and small pharma or biotech companies. And then the survey also breaks it down by years of experience.

So MSL-based salaries can vary significantly depending on the therapeutic area, geographic region, years of experience. educational background, and then size of the company, as well as a company's product and pipeline life cycle. So this is a comparison of the average base salary of MSLs from around the globe. The MSL Society hired an external research firm to collect and analyze the data from over 2000 participants from 60 countries around the world. So this is 2022 data. And keep in mind that the MSL role may be defined differently around the world. They may take on other responsibilities similar to commercial sales or marketing. So from those that participated in the 2021 salary survey, the majority of managers or directors of MSLs based in the US use the report as their primary salary benchmark data. I know we use this for our, not only just the MSL society data, but other data that we use as benchmark for our hire for this year. And so as you can see, there is a wide range of salaries and the MSL pay trends on the higher side in the US and then it increases annually, about 3%.

This is a snapshot of the 2022 average base salary of MSLs in the US according to years of experience. And as you can see on the left, the average starting salary is about 160,000. That's not including benefits, which makes it a very attractive compensation, even with less than one year of experience. The salary increases about 3% every year, as I mentioned. However, this is underestimating how much MSLs make because it doesn't include the long-term benefits which could be another 30 to $50,000. For example, some of those benefits are health insurance, 401k, stock options, a company car, and an expense account, which are added on top of your base salary. Now on the right is the average starting salary for an MSL manager or director. It usually starts above $200,000, but varies according to the years of experience. So if you see though that the difference here from managers compared to the MSL's salary is that it varies and it doesn't necessarily mean a trend up as one gains more experience. The years of experience of being a manager or director doesn't always translate to higher pay. And sometimes they do take a pay cut to move up into a company.

So when I was doing my research and deciding on whether the MSL job was right for me, I thought it was important to write down the pros and cons of being an MSL. And I... And I suggest you do the same transitioning, if you're transitioning from clinical to non-clinical. So please note that this is not a comprehensive list and it's very subjective. So for the pros, I showed on the previous slide that MSLs in the US are well compensated with a high base salary. Remote work is a plus, especially during the pandemic when I started. But working from home may not be suitable for some people. Having a flexible schedule includes making your own work schedule, arranging your own meetings and then. healthcare providers, meetings, as well as booking work travel. And there is at least 50% within your region or territory. And travel may be a deal breaker for some, but for me, it suits my lifestyle. And also there are great benefits that I explained. Some of the cons. So for industry is highly regulated and there is a lot of compliance and rules to follow. There is some loss of autonomy there. It's a transition from being a discoverer, for instance, like in academia, to being a knower. You know, you will not have a lot of patient interaction if you were a clinician and moving into becoming an MSL. And will certainly not be a scientist, but rather more of a communicator of science. And then you're going to be part of a larger team that is metrics driven and performance driven. So for example, you're measured on the number of healthcare provider. Outreach and interactions, insights and presentations, those are part of your metrics. Access to healthcare providers and scheduling face-to-face meetings. They were very difficult during the pandemic. But then we made it work through a hybrid kind of meetings where we had virtual and also in-person once they started opening up to vendors and to industry. So it's about really finding creative ways of gaining access.

The MSL role is very competitive. You will be competing against experienced MSLs for every single role you apply for. Breaking in is not easy, but it's not impossible. And most companies will require having MSL experience. It does take a lot of hard work and the right match to find that ideal job. And now I just, I'm going to pause here for a minute and just talk about one thing that I did not touch on. And that is that negative impression or that bias about working in industry. And you know, I came from academia came from practice as well. And I specifically titled my talk, going from academia to the dark side to illustrate this bias. But as someone who has worked on both sides, I believe education and having an open mind are key in tackling these biases and assumptions when considering transitioning to industry. And this section is going to be talking about how to become an MSL. I can be whole another presentation and discussion, but I'll just take a few minutes to talk about some steps and strategies that has worked for me and others. And the bottom line is preparation is key.

So remember that there are no general MSL roles. There are all disease state or therapeutic area focus. The first step is to really identify your therapeutic area or TA. For example, you could be conducting research in Alzheimer's and your disease state focuses neurology or neuroscience. or if you are conducting sickle cell anemia research, your TA will be hematology. If you want to exponentially increase your chances of breaking into your first MSL role, I'd say the three most important things are really to match, match. Match and find those target companies, target roles, and only apply to those once you have done your research and preparation. Next, research the role in the company you'd like to work for. I'd say do that now, follow the company on social media or even on Twitter, on LinkedIn, know everything you can about the company because when it does come time to interview, what I did is I told the company, I said, I've been following you for years, which is, it's a good sign that you actually are very knowledgeable about them. It also allows you more opportunities that help you get in front of people as you network and then get your foot in the door. There are also, for example, internships or fellowships offered because these can count as experience. translatable experience. And so too, you wanna look at and see if there's companies that have internships and apply for those opportunities. Attend industry-wide conferences and events and really build your network. Let them know you, your face and really introduce yourself and be proactive. A focus on quality professional contacts that are directly related to the MSL community. and identify key MSL leaders in medical affairs at companies that are of interest to you. So this is the most effective and easiest way to connect with a hiring manager and other key decision-makers. So the more relevant connections you make, the greater chance you will be successful in breaking in. So become an active member of MSL relevant groups, like the MSL Society, and there's others out there, cheeky scientists. This will allow you to really increase the network your circle of influence with those MSLs in industry, but also in the companies that you are interested in. It's really challenging to achieve on your own your circle of influence without the help of your network. So I highly encourage you to expand your reach and get out of your comfort zone and connect with others.

It's also really challenging to achieve becoming an MSL on your own without proper preparation and guidance. You will need to really stand apart from the competition. So there's also MSL trainings offered for aspiring MSLs, especially if you have no MSL experience. That's a great way to upscale, build your skills. If you lack industry experience or research experience, you know, we wanna keep pace with the changing demands of the profession. And if you need to enroll in online courses to learn about clinical trials or regulatory compliance, I'll provide a list of resources too with websites at the end of this talk.

John: Physicians are uniquely positioned to enter the biopharma industry. They obviously use the products produced by biopharma and are very comfortable discussing the research, development, and deployment of new pharmaceuticals, diagnostic tests, and medical devices. In today's presentation, Maria provided a nice review of the pros and cons of the MSL job, the likely salary to expect, and sound advice to help you transition into the role. If you'd like to hear the rest of our presentation and the other 11 topics presented at the 2023 Non-Clinical Careers Summit, you can check that out at nonc forward slash two zero two three summit. That's nonc forward slash twenty three summit. That's all one word, no hyphens.

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The post Find Your Great First Nonclinical MSL Job appeared first on NonClinical Physicians.